8. Practitioner's Podcast: Disciples Who Struggle With Consistency in Their Devotional Life
Hey everybody. Welcome back to the Practitioner's podcast where we're replying Jesus style, disciple making to everyday life. This episode in all of our episodes are powered by Navigators, church Ministries, which focus on helping churches make disciples who can make disciples. For more information or to get connected, go to navigators church ministries.org.
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Speaking of reminders, today's episode is a reminder about some of the things that we need to do on a daily basis. This episode is perfect for disciples who struggle with consistency in their devotional life. It's perfect for disciples who struggle with consistency in their devotional life. Justin, why don't you give us some background information, kind of fill us in cuz we, we, we have a little bit of a different plane than we normally do for this.
Yes, we do. So this is gonna be a bit of a different episode, and part of it is because as Tony and I were going through our normal. , , kind of notes as far as prepping the episode. We realized that we're kind of on different places on this, or at least we weren't. , communication wasn't flowing easily, and so we thought the best thing to do was just jump on and try to communicate through the miscommunication, through the fog with all of you, , so that you can kind of get that clarity the same way and same time that we get that clarity.
But today's episode is titled How to. How to eat. And this is something that I've been thinking about for a while, actually lately because, , the topic of how do you develop a, a life, a, , , habits around spending time with God. Okay. The other thing you're gonna notice as we're talking through this is that, , I'm probably gonna fumble over my words as I'm thinking, right.
So, right, because also because you're trying not to use one very specific word. I have been , which is kind of the crux. Yes. See, normally Justin kills this part, but because we're trying not to use a word, because we're gonna talk about the word, it's a little awkward. . That's right. So, The word that I'm trying not to use, and then we'll talk about why is quiet times.
Okay. So, , here's, here's the thing. So I think that it is possible to have a very robust, a very healthy life with God without having any quiet times. Not a single one. I think you can do it now, that is, for some of you listening, that is like a shocking statement Now for others. Like Tony, for example.
Tony, we were talking about different things. So let me just say what I mean when I'm talking about a quiet time. And so I was brought up in, , disciple making context in environments where a quiet time meant something really specific. A quiet time was when you took a certain amount of time. Not a long time.
It's a daily time. It is maybe 10 minutes, 15, 20. Could be more, could be less. But generally that's the stretch of time. 10 to 20 minutes. And in that time, you are going to pray a short prayer. You're gonna spend time in the word looking and reading and just observing, basically. , and then at the end, you're gonna try to find something that you're gonna chew on, something that you are going to think more about, something that you're gonna do that day.
And then you're gonna pray and end that time. And that was your quiet time. You just. . Okay. Now, for me, I, I struggled with quiet times for a long time, and part of why I wanted to do this episode is because I believe that there's a lot of others out there that carry a similar definition of a quiet time and also carry a similar struggle that I carried for a long time.
And so that's kind of how I want to open it up. Tony, why don't you, , talk about what you heard before we got on and, and how that went. Well, so what's interesting is I did not grow up in an evangelical mainline kind of Protestant tradition where quiet time was defined as what some people might call the sandwich technique.
Pray, read, pray. Right. In my world when you say I don't have a, I don't think a quiet time's important. What I'm hearing you say is, , intentional time with the Lord is not. . And that's absolutely, you don't mean that at all because No. You value that deeply, right? Yes. Yep. That's not what I'm saying. Right.
So when I hear you say that, and when I heard you say that the first time as we were talking about, I was like, well, Justin, we're gonna have to agree to disagree right there, because I think a time with the Lord every day is important. But again, I didn't, I didn't grow up in an environment that said it had to be, , formulaic in the sense of like a quiet time.
Pray, read, pray. Right? Yeah. And, and, and so, you know, as we were talking about this, one of the questions I had for you, , because it was less of an issue for me is h why, where, where did this kind of like, Idea of quiet time came from, like, what, what did it, what was it born out of? How, how did we come to this place where in some pockets of our Christian communities, this is a, , a, a standard definition.
Yeah. And I didn't know, I don't know exactly where, where we got that standard definition, but I, I know, and I, I think I asked you, I said, . Well, first you asked me, you said, well, why, why do you not like this so much? And it's not that I don't like it, it's not that I think it's terrible to pray and read your Bible and pray.
I mean, I, I have done that. I've done that for stretches of times. I still do that. , just not necessarily daily. , and what I said to you was, I don't think it's biblical. And, and you said, I said, well, Jesus clearly went away to pray. He spent time by himself seemingly often, if not daily, right. To, to commune with the father.
Yep, yep. And clearly he did those things. And so that was kind of as we started to figure out, oh, we're not talking about exactly the same thing here, but I've been in context repeatedly where people will. Take me and others to those sorts of scriptures and point to and say, well see, Jesus had a quiet time.
And internally I'm thinking, well, you're just showing me a place where Jesus went and prayed, and that's not what you're trying to tell me I need to be doing each and every day. , although we do, we should be praying each and every day. Right. Here's, here's what I've learned, right? And part of it comes out of the wheel illustration.
So we talked about the wheel in a previous episode. , we talked about the seven basics of the seven habits, , back in season two, episode 15, which is kind of around the wheel in the, one of the spokes of the wheel, , is the word. And out of the word is broken up, , in navigator context and other contexts.
Three primary habits of how do we engage The word one is a quiet time. Define just kind of how I defined it early in the episode. The second would be scripture memory, and the third would be Bible study. , and one of the things that I've learned over the years is that for, for many people, a quiet time in the way I defined it again, has something that is okay, but not as helpful as some of those other one.
And so how to eat, right? So my, my opening analogy when I thought we were gonna be on a similar page here and not have to go down the road we're going down was, have you ever , have you ever had a really big, big meal? The, the type of meal where you had to back away from the table unbutton your. Settle down for a nap.
Right. You've had this kind of meal, right? Sure. Thanksgiving obviously comes to mind quickly. Yes. And we just recently had Thanksgiving and so, , that's the sort of feasting, right? That, that I wanna have when and when I'm spending time with God. I think we all wanna have that. Yeah. Right. But there are certain things in our life where if you have a meal that.
your body needs time to digest it. Right? And this idea of a quiet time, I found that for some people, , this daily small amount of intake, , you know, it's kind of like a normal meal. , , like a Bible study where you're doing observation, interpretation, application, you're spending a couple hours in a chapter trying to pull it apart and compare and understand all sorts of things about it is more like a Thanksgiving dinner.
, in which case you can't, can't really do that so well every day unless you're really active right in ministry and you're getting that out. , and then scripture memory, which has been the one that has fed me the most is more. I don't even know. Like a cow maybe that that's chewing it up and then is still digesting it for days, really.
Right. Or for the whole day. And so just like we have different ways that we like to eat, , you know, with all these diets that are out there, the no carb, the omad, have you heard the Omad Tony? No . OHMA stands for one meal a day. , so there's people that only eat one meal a day. Oh, mad there's paleo, intermittent, fast.
There's, that would make me so sad. , right? So there's different ways that we eat physically, and I think that we need to make sure that we don't communicate to those that we're leading, that there's only one way to eat spiritually, or there's only one way to eat. You know, in our daily times with God. So, , Tony, what was it that you were telling me about kind of what your take on quiet time when you heard that term, what did you think?
I was meaning? Yeah. So f the way that I've always thought about it in my head pro, it goes back to probably one of the first people who, , whoever kind of really. instigated me into the practice. Right? And so I would say that a quiet time is a daily, intentional time spent with the Lord, right? And it, it doesn't necessarily have to be defined.
And I, I, I wouldn't have used this language back then when I first heard about it. This is almost a decade ago. But, , what I would say now is that there are a lot of tools that we can use to fill that intentional time that, that there's not one set tool. And for different seasons of my life, , you know, there have been tools that have worked and, and every year I try to bring in new disciplines, new tools so that I can commune with the Lord in a more, , full way, in a way that I think that he, he's called me to.
So, you know, one, one of the things that I have been wrestling with this year is during my, , During my quiet time is this idea, and again, I would use the term quiet time. You would not my, in my intentional time with the Lord, let me be clear, right? I would, I would use sitting in silence as one of them, right?
Mm-hmm. , that's a part of my daily routine right now. , most days, not every day. Sometimes I don't have time for it, or sometimes I don't. Feel it, or I just kinda let the Lord lead me on it. But I've been trying to sit in silence. It's a result of the, you know, the, the silent retreat that you and I go on every year.
Yep. , and so that's been a part of my, of my daily intentional time, what I would call, that's a part of my quiet time. So my quiet time right now, my daily intentional time involves some prayer, involves some quiet, sitting in silence. Sometimes it involves an in-depth study of Bible. Sometimes it involves a short devotional that I'm doing with a couple of guys who I'm discipling and other times it, I mean, it's, it's just not formulaic.
It's just every day I block out time for the Lord. Yeah. Yeah. I love that. And I think that's where we're, we're saying the same thing, right? Mm-hmm. is that God calls us to seek, . Right? Seek him daily, right. Matthew 6 33. But seek first is kingdom and his righteousness and all these things will be given to you as well.
Hebrews 11, six talks about how he rewards those who earnestly seek him. It's the seeking that we need to be diligent in, and I think we can be reliably guided by our hunger as long as we're not an infant. Right? So again, the physical mirrors, the spiritual. And so we cannot rely on an infant to know when they need to eat, , for most people if they're healthy, right?
So if we're starting from a healthy place, you can rely on your hunger to know when you need to eat. Now, of course, even with adults physically, there are times that you can get unhealthy with that. And so sometimes you just eat cuz it's time to eat and you should do that. , but this idea of seeking daily weather.
a quiet time. The way I talk about it, whether it's silence, whether it is Bible study or scripture memory, I think there are three things that kind of, for me, hold them together that no matter which one of those I'm doing, and there's a lot of, a lot that we didn't even mention, , those three things are, it's reflection, right?
So we've talked about on here before, the number one driver of spiritual growth is reflection on scripture. . And so reflecting on God's word is super important. There's lots of different ways that we can do that. , the second piece would be application, right? So we're not just thinking about it, right?
We're talk can't just, , have it as part of our minds. We need to have it as part of our life to live it out. , because otherwise we can deceive ourselves like James James 1 22 talks about. And then the last one is repetition, right? That we are repeating daily and we're repeating with regularity. , these opportunities or these instances or roads of pursuing and seeking, , God and learning more about him.
Yeah, and I I think one of the things that's important is, I hear you talk about this, this idea about, , food and being mature and, , one of the things that, that we have to know is when we have to be self-aware enough to know when we're. Eating healthy. Yeah. Let, let me explain a little bit because I, I think it's an important distinction is that there are seasons in my, , intentional time with God rhythm where it has 100% been going through the motions.
Yeah. And some of you may be listening are are there right now. And, and what I've learned, and, and Justin, I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on this as well, but what I've learned is, is that if I. , if I'm not in a healthy place in my, in my intentional time with the Lord, if I'm just going through the motions, if I'm in a rut, then I need to go to my spiritual fathers, the Council Council of the Godly people in my life, and I need to think about another way to consume the nutrition.
I need to stay. Now, one of the other things that's really important is to know, ,
for me at least, I can't take time off from a daily intentional time with the Lord. Like I, I'm just, I'm prone to wonder, like I, I, you know, as the, as the song says, right? Like, I just know that I'm prone to wonder to places that aren't healthy and next thing you. , I've used my phone to replace my intentional time with the work.
You know, I'm, I'm not eating healthy. Does that make sense? I, yeah. I feel like I'm rambling a bit. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. So we have to be, have that awareness of whether we're really seeking God or whether we're going through the motions. What I hear you saying, and that if we are only going through the motions or we're degrading or seeking to a point where it's just junk food, that's not gonna sustain us.
Yeah, and this time with God gives us the opportunity to build strength and connection with him. But just like eating in and of itself doesn't necessarily build strength, right? If we're eating junk food, if we're eating a lot and just sitting around, instead of building strength, we'll be building, you know, habits that promote laziness and you know, all sorts of things that we don't want.
But it's when we. . , we eat and then we're, we're truly seeking, we're truly applying the things that he's talking about. That's where the strength is built. Right. And so, yeah. I I love that, that we have to, you said it for you, but I think it's for all of us, right. That I think there's a clear imperative in scripture that we are called to seek him every day.
Right. And the Yeah, I think that's right. The seeking is, can look. And that's okay, right? We don't want to push people into a mold of how to do it. , that may or may not work for them. But what we want to encourage is something deeper, right? The deeper principles of seeking God, reflecting on his word and what he's communicating to us and to you.
Applying it to your life and doing this over and over and over again. This is what he's called to. This is, , a picture of a healthy devotional life, not necessarily one form of how to seek. Yeah, I, I was thinking as you were talking about that, I was reminded of the, the shima from Deuteronomy six, right?
Four through six says here, Israel, the Lord is our God. The Lord is one, and you shall love the Lord. Your. With all your heart, with all your soul, with all your strength. These words, which I'm commanding you today, shall be on your heart. And for me, I think that that's probably one of the, the keys to all of this.
So, , if you're here today and you're listening to all this and we just rocked your world around quiet time, you're welcome. . Let us know. Hopefully, hopefully our conversation in different way that, that we went. Was helpful. Right. Tony, did we get a takeaway? Do we have a takeaway? Do we have an action step today?
I, yeah. I think the takeaway is, is right along those same lines, it's okay to eat differently from others. It's okay to eat differently from others. And the action step. Is to commit to daily nourishment. Commit to living out, , what it means to follow the Lord. Guys, we're thankful for each and every one of you for the time we got to spend today.
We hope that this conversation helps you move closer to following Jesus and to making Jesus style disciples. As always, if you need to get ahold of us, , all the links are in the show notes. We're incredibly thankful and we'll see you guys real soon.